CollegeSportsUnfiltered.com

College sports... without the power-hungry mods!

You are not logged in.

Poll: Why is attendance down? Pick as many as you'd like
Lack of wins against name teams like Kentucky

8% (6)
USM has gone left politically: state flag, diversity...

13% (10)
Futility / irrelevance of bottom 4 conference football

19% (14)
Gilbert has raised prices / ceased giveaways

5% (4)
Hopson comes across as a hick, not an ambassador

2% (2)
Recent home opponents are no-names w/o history

16% (12)
Las Vegas shooting / security concerns

0% (0)
Lack of TV exposure

4% (3)
It's a general trend; people watch sports on TV now

9% (7)
The numbers weren't ever real. They're more real now

6% (5)
The parking situation is bad

1% (1)
On-field performance, e.g. vs. NLU

10% (8)
Other (comment please)

1% (1)
Voters: 19

#1 2018-10-21 20:13:35 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere (640)
Member
From: Dunwoody, GA
Registered: 2017-08-24
Posts: 5,415

Attendance woes: want your thoughts

As recently as the 2016 season, home attendance was significantly better than now. Announced attendance averaged around 29,000, and even though those figures can be gamed, it's clear that there were more people at M.M. Roberts.

I've given some thoughts to the reasons, but I wasn't able to arrive at an opinion as to the relative importance of these reasons. So I'm soliciting your thoughts. Which of these factors do you think have played a major role?


Bring back Reed V. "Pie" TurkPalmer Eustachy.

Online

#2 2018-10-22 06:58:30 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

USMstang (245)
Member
From: 7 miles North of Cat Island
Registered: 2017-08-25
Posts: 964

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

I went with politics/social injustice warrior prez, losing to shit teams, and no-names visiting the Pebble. 

Being politically correct is a sign of weakness from "leadership".  Hiring idiots at AD who hire idiot coaches is not smart. Years of poor leadership get you shitty conference affiliation with no-name brethren.  Simple as that.


Still sleeping with a Dixie Darling!

Offline

#3 2018-10-22 07:46:32 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

skyvoyager (28)
Member
Registered: 2017-09-13
Posts: 108

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere wrote:

As recently as the 2016 season, home attendance was significantly better than now. Announced attendance averaged around 29,000, and even though those figures can be gamed, it's clear that there were more people at M.M. Roberts.

I've given some thoughts to the reasons, but I wasn't able to arrive at an opinion as to the relative importance of these reasons. So I'm soliciting your thoughts. Which of these factors do you think have played a major role?

i dont doubt that 29,000 was 'announced' but that seems awfully high... there was ~30,000 at e12loss home opener loss to ecu and maybe ~30,000 ( or less ) during the fedora years

probably the biggest issue is the great divide between the P5 and the rest and the horrible conference we have found ourselves in....


Everyone has the right to be stupid... It's just that some people abuse the privilege.

Online

#4 2018-10-22 09:10:50 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

EagleFWB (72)
Member
Registered: 2017-12-05
Posts: 191

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Bottom line is you have a core fan base who is tired of years and years of poor decisions by the admin. We are in a horrible conference with no rivals because all the teams that were rivals have moved on to greener pastures while here we sit. We've watched teams we beat the hell of of leave us in the dust. We constantly squander any momentum that we ever get by making dumbass coaching hires, etc. We've all talked about this for years over and over again. Unless something major changes, and soon, I just don't see it turning around. There is little to no enthusiasm any more.

For what it's worth, there does appear to be a buzz about our unhappiness within the coaching community. Not sure if that is worth a squirt of piss right now, but at least there's a little smoke.

Offline

#5 2018-10-22 20:24:33 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere (640)
Member
From: Dunwoody, GA
Registered: 2017-08-24
Posts: 5,415

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

EagleFWB wrote:

For what it's worth, there does appear to be a buzz about our unhappiness within the coaching community. Not sure if that is worth a squirt of piss right now, but at least there's a little smoke.

I think it's a good thing, even if it's too little / too late. "Just fine" was our enemy for so long. I was calling bullshit on that attitude long before the "AAC" was even a conference.

And yet it endured so long. About a year ago, Chuck Oliver from 680 AM in Atlanta had the Big Gold Nation dude (Lanny?) on his radio program, and asked him about the morale and attitude of the fan base. Lanny's response was pure just-finery.

It blew my mind. Like, here's the one major media figure on the planet who's following this shit, and he hands you the mike, and we get... that. I should have started a board 15 years ago I guess.


Bring back Reed V. "Pie" TurkPalmer Eustachy.

Online

Liked by:

#6 2018-10-22 21:12:46 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

USMstang (245)
Member
From: 7 miles North of Cat Island
Registered: 2017-08-25
Posts: 964

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Lanny = disengaged


Still sleeping with a Dixie Darling!

Offline

Liked by:

#7 2018-10-22 21:21:43 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere (640)
Member
From: Dunwoody, GA
Registered: 2017-08-24
Posts: 5,415

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

USMstang wrote:

Lanny = disengaged

I always got the impression that he wanted to be perceived as a real journalist. But then a story got dropped in his lap, the story of how a not insignificant fanbase got left on the beach waiting for a ship out, and he just didn't have the bottle to actually cover it. And now no one posts on his board I guess. Sunrise, sunset, man.


Bring back Reed V. "Pie" TurkPalmer Eustachy.

Online

#8 2018-10-23 06:43:02 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

tg300 (314)
Member
Registered: 2017-08-25
Posts: 932

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere wrote:
USMstang wrote:

Lanny = disengaged

I always got the impression that he wanted to be perceived as a real journalist. But then a story got dropped in his lap, the story of how a not insignificant fanbase got left on the beach waiting for a ship out, and he just didn't have the bottle to actually cover it. And now no one posts on his board I guess. Sunrise, sunset, man.

Buffet assassin - yes

Real journalist - no

Offline

Liked by:

#9 2018-10-23 11:49:48 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Nugget's Ghostbuster (640)
Member
From: U.S. Department of Interior
Registered: 2017-08-25
Posts: 2,597

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

I'm calling bull$hit on you guys. Its not an opponent thing. If it was you wouldn't have a Hop team taking on Troy in 2016 have a bigger gate than #4 Cal coming to The Rock......hell we had probably more Texas Longhorn fans at that Cal game than true USM fans......  Even a top ranked Boise St didn't even come close to selling out during Fedoras first season.
I was at the HOME OPENER against top 20 Texas AM in 1998.....the debut of our new friggin scoreboard and it wasn't a sellout even though it goes in the books as 33K.....the books lied that day...........and don't tell me about the threat of bad weather because it wasn't there until late in that contest. Hell, two guys were still working on the construction of that scoreboard during the game.

Its not a conference thing. If that were the case you wouldn't have a game against Memphis late in the 2011 "DREAM" season only drawing 26K.........or playing for a conf championship against #10 TCU in 2003 not selling out.

Hell I remember one of the few "honest" almost sellouts we had in the last 25 years was against friggin Northern Illinois........not Illinois, we only had 22K in the stands for Illinois.......I'm talking about Northern Illinois in 1995.

We have ALWAYS had piss poor attendance regardless of who we are playing inside or outside of conference. We are probably at best a 24K per game school all things considered including enrollment, location to other SEC schools and a poor ass city that doesnt support one of its biggest tax bases.
One of the ONLY things Dilbert did right was to get honest with the gate. I've been to games during Bower, Fed, Monken and Hop years. We added 3K in 2008 which essentially just shifted part of the crowd from the sides to the endzone so it looks worse today in comparison but its not.......

You want to try and fix this.....do what I said before. Make that endzone rooftop a party deck. Drop down to 4 home games a year and spread them out......two in Sept., one in Oct and one in early November before the break. Add concerts to the mix every home game that people actually recognize. I can get Tone Loc to play for 10K on Black Alumni Discount Weekend......I can get Night Ranger for 7K for 80's Rock Night. I can get The Indigo Girls for LGBTQ Nights for 10K and last I can get Matt and Kim for 15K for Little Millennials Night.......

Random Sampling of Gate:

2018 JSU 29K
2017 Kentucky 22K
2016 Troy 28K
2014 App St 22K
2011 Memphis 26K

P5/Top Ranked Games that were not even close to sellouts:

2010 Kansas
2009 Virginia
2008 #15 Boise St
2006 NC State
2004 #4 Cal 27K
2003 #10 TCU 30K
2002 Illinois 22K


"In this edition of To The Top, I'll share how I spent Eagle Club donations on a 7-day wilderness experience on the Superior Hiking Trail in northern Minnesota."

Offline

#10 2018-10-23 13:23:19 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

skyvoyager (28)
Member
Registered: 2017-09-13
Posts: 108

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Nugget's Ghostbuster wrote:

I'm calling bull$hit on you guys. Its not an opponent thing. If it was you wouldn't have a Hop team taking on Troy in 2016 have a bigger gate than #4 Cal coming to The Rock......hell we had probably more Texas Longhorn fans at that Cal game than true USM fans......  Even a top ranked Boise St didn't even come close to selling out during Fedoras first season.
I was at the HOME OPENER against top 20 Texas AM in 1998.....the debut of our new friggin scoreboard and it wasn't a sellout even though it goes in the books as 33K.....the books lied that day...........and don't tell me about the threat of bad weather because it wasn't there until late in that contest. Hell, two guys were still working on the construction of that scoreboard during the game.

Its not a conference thing. If that were the case you wouldn't have a game against Memphis late in the 2011 "DREAM" season only drawing 26K.........or playing for a conf championship against #10 TCU in 2003 not selling out.

Hell I remember one of the few "honest" almost sellouts we had in the last 25 years was against friggin Northern Illinois........not Illinois, we only had 22K in the stands for Illinois.......I'm talking about Northern Illinois in 1995.

We have ALWAYS had piss poor attendance regardless of who we are playing inside or outside of conference. We are probably at best a 24K per game school all things considered including enrollment, location to other SEC schools and a poor ass city that doesnt support one of its biggest tax bases.
One of the ONLY things Dilbert did right was to get honest with the gate. I've been to games during Bower, Fed, Monken and Hop years. We added 3K in 2008 which essentially just shifted part of the crowd from the sides to the endzone so it looks worse today in comparison but its not.......

You want to try and fix this.....do what I said before. Make that endzone rooftop a party deck. Drop down to 4 home games a year and spread them out......two in Sept., one in Oct and one in early November before the break. Add concerts to the mix every home game that people actually recognize. I can get Tone Loc to play for 10K on Black Alumni Discount Weekend......I can get Night Ranger for 7K for 80's Rock Night. I can get The Indigo Girls for LGBTQ Nights for 10K and last I can get Matt and Kim for 15K for Little Millennials Night.......

Random Sampling of Gate:

2018 JSU 29K
2017 Kentucky 22K
2016 Troy 28K
2014 App St 22K
2011 Memphis 26K

P5/Top Ranked Games that were not even close to sellouts:

2010 Kansas
2009 Virginia
2008 #15 Boise St
2006 NC State
2004 #4 Cal 27K
2003 #10 TCU 30K
2002 Illinois 22K

i agree with alot of what you say but ~21,000 at homecoming this year has got to be a pretty low number for homecoming games over the last 20 years


Everyone has the right to be stupid... It's just that some people abuse the privilege.

Online

#11 2018-10-23 18:28:08 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere (640)
Member
From: Dunwoody, GA
Registered: 2017-08-24
Posts: 5,415

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

skyvoyager wrote:
Nugget's Ghostbuster wrote:

I'm calling bull$hit on you guys. Its not an opponent thing. If it was you wouldn't have a Hop team taking on Troy in 2016 have a bigger gate than #4 Cal coming to The Rock......hell we had probably more Texas Longhorn fans at that Cal game than true USM fans......  Even a top ranked Boise St didn't even come close to selling out during Fedoras first season.
I was at the HOME OPENER against top 20 Texas AM in 1998.....the debut of our new friggin scoreboard and it wasn't a sellout even though it goes in the books as 33K.....the books lied that day...........and don't tell me about the threat of bad weather because it wasn't there until late in that contest. Hell, two guys were still working on the construction of that scoreboard during the game.

Its not a conference thing. If that were the case you wouldn't have a game against Memphis late in the 2011 "DREAM" season only drawing 26K.........or playing for a conf championship against #10 TCU in 2003 not selling out.

Hell I remember one of the few "honest" almost sellouts we had in the last 25 years was against friggin Northern Illinois........not Illinois, we only had 22K in the stands for Illinois.......I'm talking about Northern Illinois in 1995.

We have ALWAYS had piss poor attendance regardless of who we are playing inside or outside of conference. We are probably at best a 24K per game school all things considered including enrollment, location to other SEC schools and a poor ass city that doesnt support one of its biggest tax bases.
One of the ONLY things Dilbert did right was to get honest with the gate. I've been to games during Bower, Fed, Monken and Hop years. We added 3K in 2008 which essentially just shifted part of the crowd from the sides to the endzone so it looks worse today in comparison but its not.......

You want to try and fix this.....do what I said before. Make that endzone rooftop a party deck. Drop down to 4 home games a year and spread them out......two in Sept., one in Oct and one in early November before the break. Add concerts to the mix every home game that people actually recognize. I can get Tone Loc to play for 10K on Black Alumni Discount Weekend......I can get Night Ranger for 7K for 80's Rock Night. I can get The Indigo Girls for LGBTQ Nights for 10K and last I can get Matt and Kim for 15K for Little Millennials Night.......

Random Sampling of Gate:

2018 JSU 29K
2017 Kentucky 22K
2016 Troy 28K
2014 App St 22K
2011 Memphis 26K

P5/Top Ranked Games that were not even close to sellouts:

2010 Kansas
2009 Virginia
2008 #15 Boise St
2006 NC State
2004 #4 Cal 27K
2003 #10 TCU 30K
2002 Illinois 22K

i agree with alot of what you say but ~21,000 at homecoming this year has got to be a pretty low number for homecoming games over the last 20 years

I agree with the idea that we've never had objectively good attendance, but it's damn sure worse this year and last than it has been in 25 years or so. I was at that Illinois game, for example, and that crowd of 22,000 looked easily 50% bigger than what we saw last weekend.


Bring back Reed V. "Pie" TurkPalmer Eustachy.

Online

#12 2018-10-23 19:06:25 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Nugget's Ghostbuster (640)
Member
From: U.S. Department of Interior
Registered: 2017-08-25
Posts: 2,597

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere wrote:

I agree with the idea that we've never had objectively good attendance, but it's damn sure worse this year and last than it has been in 25 years or so. I was at that Illinois game, for example, and that crowd of 22,000 looked easily 50% bigger than what we saw last weekend.

I honestly believe you are thrown off by the end zone expansion that didn’t exist in 2002. Do I believe we had over 20K in the stands last weekend, no. However, look at Stangs photo of the end zone crowd. You move those people to the pre 2008 configuration and it’s on par with the Illinois game.


"In this edition of To The Top, I'll share how I spent Eagle Club donations on a 7-day wilderness experience on the Superior Hiking Trail in northern Minnesota."

Offline

#13 2018-10-23 19:24:07 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere (640)
Member
From: Dunwoody, GA
Registered: 2017-08-24
Posts: 5,415

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Nugget's Ghostbuster wrote:
AndreWhere wrote:

I agree with the idea that we've never had objectively good attendance, but it's damn sure worse this year and last than it has been in 25 years or so. I was at that Illinois game, for example, and that crowd of 22,000 looked easily 50% bigger than what we saw last weekend.

I honestly believe you are thrown off by the end zone expansion that didn’t exist in 2002. Do I believe we had over 20K in the stands last weekend, no. However, look at Stangs photo of the end zone crowd. You move those people to the pre 2008 configuration and it’s on par with the Illinois game.

I was going to say I thought there were twice as many people at the Illinois game, and then I remembered that 2002 was pre-expansion. So I bumped it down to 50%.

The expansion isn't really that dense with seats. It added 3,000 to the stadium's capacity. Even if it were half full last Saturday, that's only a 1,500 person difference. Besides, I sat in the West upper deck in 2002, and there were always plenty of people around me back then. I suspect that part of the stadium was maybe 10% full at that last game. Maybe someone knows better.

I didn't remember that 2003 TCU game wasn't a sellout. Probably could have been if they'd engineered that. Seems like everyone was at that one... my ex-wife and dad, random co-workers, professors, etc. That was a fun night.


Bring back Reed V. "Pie" TurkPalmer Eustachy.

Online

#14 2018-10-23 19:34:21 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere (640)
Member
From: Dunwoody, GA
Registered: 2017-08-24
Posts: 5,415

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Just watched some highlights of that 2003 TCU game. A couple of things stood out. First, that crowd was LOUD. Definitely louder than a typical UGA crowd, size be damned.

Second, that team was BIG and FAST: Michael Boley, Etric Pruitt, Johnny Eubanks, Marvin Young. Watching that 2003 team, and the 1997 team as well, I'm impressed by the size and speed advantage those teams seem to have compared to the teams USM is fielding 15-20 years later... a time when, on average, I think young people are probably only bigger and faster on average.

That right there probably goes a long way toward explaining the loss of fan interest. That team put on a show. Absolutely crushed skulls and ran wild. Hopson's teams have more of a service academy vibe even when they win.


Bring back Reed V. "Pie" TurkPalmer Eustachy.

Online

#15 2018-10-23 19:35:44 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Nugget's Ghostbuster (640)
Member
From: U.S. Department of Interior
Registered: 2017-08-25
Posts: 2,597

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Today’s attendance is below what I saw my first year at Southern in 92. The opener against Memphis was well below last weekends crowd......and that was the home opener against a rival. The next game against La Tech was equally as bad. It doesn’t matter if we have Oklahoma State as our home opener(2001, 25K), we won’t sell it out.
Every game today is viewable on a streaming device. Kids today are not like kids 30 years ago because they now have 20 other options available to spend their money on......

Everyone is down. The Mecca of college football is going to shrink their seating soon at Alabama.

From the Tampa Bwy Times:

The Rays aren't the only team looking to downsize their stadium capacity.

It's becoming a trend in college football, too.

The latest one is mighty Alabama. As part of the Bryant-Denny Stadium renovations expected to be announced today, the Crimson Tide will reduce its seating capacity from the current 101,821, according to the Tuscaloosa News.

Florida State already did so, dropping Doak Campbell Stadium from 82,300 to 79,560 before the start of the 2016 season. Miami's new-look Hard Rock Stadium dropped capacity to about 65,000 seats. Penn State is planning to eliminate seating at Beaver Stadium, too.

And so on.

College football attendance is decreasing across the country, so maybe the extra seats aren't necessary. Depending on the specific amenities and details, schools might make more money with fewer seats by charging more for a better experience.

Regardless, when mighty 'Bama is reducing its seating capacity, it's time to start looking at the issue much more seriously.


"In this edition of To The Top, I'll share how I spent Eagle Club donations on a 7-day wilderness experience on the Superior Hiking Trail in northern Minnesota."

Offline

#16 2018-10-23 19:56:34 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Nugget's Ghostbuster (640)
Member
From: U.S. Department of Interior
Registered: 2017-08-25
Posts: 2,597

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere wrote:

That right there probably goes a long way toward explaining the loss of fan interest. That team put on a show. Absolutely crushed skulls and ran wild. Hopson's teams have more of a service academy vibe even when they win.

Yep, that TCU game was great.  Now think about this.......you win that game against a top 10 team, go to the Liberty, start the next season and beat Nebraska on the road......then win the next two games all on the road and stand 3-0 and almost top 25 when you have your home opener against Houston........

And you only draw 28K



Not a conference problem. Not a quality of product problem.

It’s who we are and have always been.......


"In this edition of To The Top, I'll share how I spent Eagle Club donations on a 7-day wilderness experience on the Superior Hiking Trail in northern Minnesota."

Offline

#17 2018-10-23 19:57:40 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere (640)
Member
From: Dunwoody, GA
Registered: 2017-08-24
Posts: 5,415

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Nugget's Ghostbuster wrote:

Today’s attendance is below what I saw my first year at Southern in 92. The opener against Memphis was well below last weekends crowd......and that was the home opener against a rival. The next game against La Tech was equally as bad. It doesn’t matter if we have Oklahoma State as our home opener(2001, 25K), we won’t sell it out.
Every game today is viewable on a streaming device. Kids today are not like kids 30 years ago because they now have 20 other options available to spend their money on......

Everyone is down. The Mecca of college football is going to shrink their seating soon at Alabama.

From the Tampa Bwy Times:

The Rays aren't the only team looking to downsize their stadium capacity.

It's becoming a trend in college football, too.

The latest one is mighty Alabama. As part of the Bryant-Denny Stadium renovations expected to be announced today, the Crimson Tide will reduce its seating capacity from the current 101,821, according to the Tuscaloosa News.

Florida State already did so, dropping Doak Campbell Stadium from 82,300 to 79,560 before the start of the 2016 season. Miami's new-look Hard Rock Stadium dropped capacity to about 65,000 seats. Penn State is planning to eliminate seating at Beaver Stadium, too.

And so on.

College football attendance is decreasing across the country, so maybe the extra seats aren't necessary. Depending on the specific amenities and details, schools might make more money with fewer seats by charging more for a better experience.

Regardless, when mighty 'Bama is reducing its seating capacity, it's time to start looking at the issue much more seriously.

The model has definitely changed. I was saying 10 years ago (as a Saints season ticket holder) that I missed cooking out and watching home games on TV.

That said, if you want to succeed in that environment, you've got to actually get on TV. That's at least as big an issue for USM as attendance is, but I'm less qualified to write a thread about that topic. I will say that our TV appeal was underestimated by nerdy East Coast media types during the last round of realignment, but that sort of thing kind also of turns into a self-fulfilling prophecy. If the Weinstein / Moonvies crowd thinks people won't watch USM football, well, give it time and that will turn true.


Bring back Reed V. "Pie" TurkPalmer Eustachy.

Online

#18 2018-10-23 20:02:50 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

AndreWhere (640)
Member
From: Dunwoody, GA
Registered: 2017-08-24
Posts: 5,415

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Nugget's Ghostbuster wrote:

Yep, that TCU game was great.  Now think about this.......you win that game against a top 10 team, go to the Liberty, start the next season and beat Nebraska on the road......then win the next two games all on the road and stand 3-0 and almost top 25 when you have your home opener against Houston........

And you only draw 28K

Not a conference problem. Not a quality of product problem.

It’s who we are and have always been.......

Very good example.

I do think it's a "conference problem" on some level. Is it an AAC vs CUSA problem? You've posted enough to make me doubt that. But MS is a state with two big football teams that define themselves by being members of the SEC. Neither has ever done much (and State has done absolutely nothing)  other than get that SEC invitation. Mississippi's two biggest team will lose, lose, lose, even while cheating, but will still draw fans because they've convinced people they play in the #1 sports league on the planet.

The die was probably cast back in the 1950s when USM "applied" to the ACC and failed. Metro football was probably the last chance to earn any credibility in-state.


Bring back Reed V. "Pie" TurkPalmer Eustachy.

Online

#19 2018-10-23 22:37:29 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Mao Tse-gore (81)
Member
Registered: 2017-08-29
Posts: 247

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

I used to upsize Eagle Club, buy season tickets and travel to home games. That changed because of the 3 leading reasons cited in this poll.


We still suck bigtime.

Success is sand-crotch volleyball.

Offline

#20 2018-10-24 06:43:41 - Attendance woes: want your thoughts

EagleFWB (72)
Member
Registered: 2017-12-05
Posts: 191

Re: Attendance woes: want your thoughts

Close off the upper decks until the lower are sold out. Then it least it won't look totally apathetic on TV.

Offline

Board footer