Fedora or Monken

stinkfist · #21

Black Diamond Reb wrote:

Pie won two national championships at Southern....they were Beach Balls

\

#inflate #deflate #rinse/repeat

today's ganja.....

high-times.jpg?w=738

99beers · #22

southern miss slacker wrote:

fedora, hands down. light years better at evaluating and developing talent than shmonken. that man worked a miracle at NC.

Fed left us shit. Monken rebuilt. Ignorant ass

AndreWhere · #23

TheChosenOne wrote:

Current coach winning same, if not more, games on average at a hell of a lot less cost.

How many games do you reckon Fedora would have won with the two teams Monken put together? I bet Fedora could have got more than 7 wins out of last year's team in particular.

TheChosenOne wrote:

But honestly, I still don’t get the Monken love.

Yeah, it's a weird phenomenon. Same way with Tyndall-vs.-Eustachy or even James Green.

tg300 · #24

AndreWhere wrote:

TheChosenOne wrote:
Current coach winning same, if not more, games on average at a hell of a lot less cost.
How many games do you reckon Fedora would have won with the two teams Monken put together? I bet Fedora could have got more than 7 wins out of last year's team in particular.
TheChosenOne wrote:
But honestly, I still don’t get the Monken love.
Yeah, it's a weird phenomenon. Same way with Tyndall-vs.-Eustachy or even James Green.

Monken brought us out of a self created hell hole.

We owe him a huge debt for that.

That being said, I would take an endless string of Larry the hats parading through here every 3-4 years from now until 3030.

We are a stepping stone. Hire coaches with their hair on fire to move up EVERY time and they will drag the program up with them.

This isn't rocket surgery.

Running JG off was inexcusable.

Running LE off was downright stupid.

beagle, Fake Ellis Johnson, stinkfist

99beers · #25

Not making a better effort to keep monken was the worst.

Reggie Favre · #26

this may seem like a pointless topic and kind of stings, but its a really good topic nonetheless. i like both Fedora and Monken a LOT. however, there is plenty good and bad to say about them both.

i look at Fedora as one of the great coaches we have had, but when you look at his record, it was "only" 7-6, 7-6, 8-5 and then the 12-2 season (with the UAB loss). at the same time, i felt like the teams were better than their record, bc (as i posted on some board years ago), he was in virtually EVERY FUCKING GAME HE EVER COACHED! Of the 19 losses, 14 were within one score, 3 were within two scores and only 2 were by more than 3 scores (17 and 28 pts losses). Think about that a second. its really unreal. He also inherited a winning program, so it should have been fairly easy to win. however, it was rumored that the team didn't take to him and were pissed about Bower being fired so didnt try hard at first. when they realized the winning streak was on the line, they ran off 5 straight wins. if the rumor is true, that team could have won a few more games for sure. Fedora was def a better coach his first year than Monken was his first year. he was def a better recruiter too. however, he still hasn't found out how to play defense and it took him too long to fire as shitty coordinator.

Monken's first year team was the fucking worst team i have ever seen in the history of D1 college football (im sure there were worse but i never saw them). that team got their teeth kicked in by 30, 40 and 50+ points (six of those losses)! Nine (9) losses by 21 or more points! just fucking unreal. EJ IS the worst coach of all time and one of the biggest pieces of shit, but his team may have beaten the hell out of Monks first year team despite them trying to lose games. Monk obviously inherited a shit situation, but i cant imagine Fedora going 1-11 like that. Monks second team was still pretty damn bad. i think had Mullens not gotten injured they may have won 2 more games...but 5 wins still sux (esp how shitty the conference was/is). Of the 5 losses in Monk's last year, only 1 was by one score (and that was 8 pts so kinda 2 scores).

Now after writing all that, it would seem clear who the right answer is or should be. however, i voted for Monken. why? one reason, is bc i voted yesterday before writing all that out. also, bc the original question is who would you chose TODAY. certainly, LF was better from the start and it took Monken longer to figure things out. However, i think today, Monk has learned things better. Ive no doubt his offense (or LF's for that matter) would be great. I think Monks may even be better. But i think Monk has figured out how to develop a defense a little better and would make coaching changes quicker (i could be wrong about that). I like them both a lot. I like both of their attitudes and personalities. love Monk's openness and no nonsense with the media, etc., but sometimes it could be a negative. Monk is just a really genuine guy that seems to genuinely care a lot about his players, fans, etc. (he started buying the suits for seniors). i think he deals better with player personalities. LF didn't really play D Brown enough imo. there seemed to be some conflict between them at times. LF is prob a better overall recruiter and Monk doesn't like all the BS with coaching in the college game, but if he took a college gig again, he would be a sufficient enough recruiter. recruiting would have gotten easier for him if he stayed and had an established winning program.

Therefore, I think Monken could walk in and be a better HC at this point in their careers. LF's defense just worries me after all these years. I like them both a lot and reserve the right to change my mind.

I'll give ole Hop a chance. If he can learn from his dumbass mistakes, maybe he can surpass them both.

beagle · #27

tg300 wrote:

AndreWhere wrote:
TheChosenOne wrote:
Current coach winning same, if not more, games on average at a hell of a lot less cost.
How many games do you reckon Fedora would have won with the two teams Monken put together? I bet Fedora could have got more than 7 wins out of last year's team in particular.
TheChosenOne wrote:
But honestly, I still don’t get the Monken love.
Yeah, it's a weird phenomenon. Same way with Tyndall-vs.-Eustachy or even James Green.
Monken brought us out of a self created hell hole.
We owe him a huge debt for that.
That being said, I would take an endless string of Larry the hats parading through here every 3-4 years from now until 3030.
We are a stepping stone. Hire coaches with their hair on fire to move up EVERY time and they will drag the program up with them.
This isn't rocket surgery.
Running JG off was inexcusable.
Running LE off was downright stupid.

You get it.

USMstang · #28

I loved Fedora's fire and scoring. I hated that a former DB had no care for Defense.

It was brutal to witness Monken's learning curve but he learned. A fourth year of Monk would have been nice to watch.

beagle · #29

SoMs Eagle wrote:

beagle wrote:
SoMs Eagle wrote:
It appears he recruits much better than either.
Hopson recruits better than Fedora?
Yes.

Fedora was bringing in 4 and 5 star players, which has never been done at Southern Miss in the Rivals/Scout era. Yeah, a lot of those guys didn't pan out but he was bringing in blue-chip talent. Hopson has brought in some decent players, but they aren't anywhere close to the guys Fedora had. Fedora's classes were ahead of a handful of P5/BCS schools. Now I will say that Hopson is a better recruiter than Monken, mainly because Monken hated recruiting and was more worried about Xs and Os.

Now in Hopson's defense, the program had not been totally destroyed by Giannini and Johnson yet when Fedora was here. We aren't considered as attractive of a program to recruits anymore. Also, USA, UTSA, and some of these other start-ups had not yet emerged when Fedora was head coach. But I'd still say that Fedora is/was the better recruiter.

Last edited by beagle (2017-12-13 19:59:23)

beagle · #30

USMstang wrote:

I loved Fedora's fire and scoring. I hated that a former DB had no care for Defense.
It was brutal to witness Monken's learning curve but he learned. A fourth year of Monk would have been nice to watch.

I don't think there was a learning curve. Monk just inherited a truly terrible situation. Even Saban or Meyer would have struggled. Remember that we were playing ~55 scholarship guys at points in 2013. Unheard of at the FBS level.

beagle · #31

Black Diamond Reb wrote:

Pie won two national championships at Southern. But that can't compare to SUNWACUSA runnerups, Poydras Bowl titles, and Beach Bowls I guess.

College Division titles. Today's FCS.

EagleFWB · #32

We really didn't have enough time with Monk to see how far he could take us. His first two years he had a really shitty hand. I really wish we could have had years 4 and 5 with him. I think it would have been special to see.

beagle

AndreWhere · #33

beagle wrote:

USMstang wrote:
I loved Fedora's fire and scoring. I hated that a former DB had no care for Defense.
It was brutal to witness Monken's learning curve but he learned. A fourth year of Monk would have been nice to watch.
I don't think there was a learning curve.

There was some curve. He knew how to coach when he arrived in Hattiesburg, though.

beagle · #34

TheHeadEagle wrote:

Liked them both but Fedora won a championship and had the fan base more fired up than I've ever seen in the last 20 years. Monken is good but lacks Fedora's fire. Monken only lasted 3 seasons and never won a championship.....he's unproven in my mind. For god sakes, he had ONE winning season at Southern Miss in the worst conference in College Football. Fedora has had 2 losing seasons in 10 seasons, with both at North Carolina (one while on probation and only because they lost the bowl game, and this year). North Carolina is not a football school. That's a proven coach.
One winning season in a shit conference does not equate to a great coach. Good lord.

Monken inherited NOTHING. We were playing with less scholarship players than FCS schools because of mismanagement under EJ. If he took over in 2012 instead of 2013, he would have had us rolling.

Monken interviewed after Fedora left but he cursed in the interview which pissed off Martha.

Last edited by beagle (2017-12-13 20:13:15)

USMstang · #35

Are you fucking kidding? That bitch cursed the whole damn school!!!

beagle · #36

USMstang wrote:

Are you fucking kidding? That bitch cursed the whole damn school!!!

Heard this a few years ago from someone who would know. Monken cursed like a sailor so it's pretty believable. Doesn't bother me a bit. If you can coach, I don't care how many fucks and shits you drop. Also, remember that Blake Anderson wore blue jeans to his interview which was another no-no for Martha. She wanted the anti-Fedora which was Ellis.

Saunders really was the Ellis Johnson of university presidents.

Last edited by beagle (2017-12-13 22:09:46)

USMstang · #37

Sounds like she was a) a narcissist and (b) not aware of how coaches operate and possibly some (c) "well I never..." sexist bullshit. Either way, I'm glad she's not here any more and sorry to see that she's running amok with someone else's school. Her ineptitude will continue to be felt for many more years around here. What a legacy and she did it to her own alma mater. Asshole...

beagle

AndreWhere · #38

You could make a Tyndall vs. Eustachy poll and the Criscopottamus would probably get a few votes.

AndreWhere · #39

USMstang wrote:

Sounds like she was a) a narcissist and (b) not aware of how coaches operate and possibly some (c) "well I never..." sexist bullshit. Either way, I'm glad she's not here any more and sorry to see that she's running amok with someone else's school. Her ineptitude will continue to be felt for many more years around here. What a legacy and she did it to her own alma mater. Asshole...

USM has had one competent president during my lifetime. The college board ran him off and he died not long after.

SoMs Eagle · #40

beagle wrote:

SoMs Eagle wrote:
beagle wrote:
Hopson recruits better than Fedora?
Yes.
Fedora was bringing in 4 and 5 star players, which has never been done at Southern Miss in the Rivals/Scout era. Yeah, a lot of those guys didn't pan out but he was bringing in blue-chip talent. Hopson has brought in some decent players, but they aren't anywhere close to the guys Fedora had. Fedora's classes were ahead of a handful of P5/BCS schools. Now I will say that Hopson is a better recruiter than Monken, mainly because Monken hated recruiting and was more worried about Xs and Os.
Now in Hopson's defense, the program had not been totally destroyed by Giannini and Johnson yet when Fedora was here. We aren't considered as attractive of a program to recruits anymore. Also, USA, UTSA, and some of these other start-ups had not yet emerged when Fedora was head coach. But I'd still say that Fedora is/was the better recruiter.

Could be argued with some success that Frank Wilson and Barney Farrow (sic) brought in the one five star you speak of.

Fedora		46% (7)
Monken		46% (7)
Neither, I love Bower and Ellis, etc		6% (1)
Voters: 16

CollegeSportsUnfiltered.com

#21 2017-12-13 15:44:33 - Fedora or Monken

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#22 2017-12-13 17:40:54 - Fedora or Monken

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#23 2017-12-13 18:00:41 - Fedora or Monken

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#24 2017-12-13 18:13:14 - Fedora or Monken

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#25 2017-12-13 18:35:43 - Fedora or Monken

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#26 2017-12-13 19:32:54 - Fedora or Monken

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#27 2017-12-13 19:46:02 - Fedora or Monken

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#28 2017-12-13 19:46:15 - Fedora or Monken

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#29 2017-12-13 19:54:29 - Fedora or Monken

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#30 2017-12-13 19:55:49 - Fedora or Monken

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#31 2017-12-13 19:56:16 - Fedora or Monken

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#32 2017-12-13 20:00:02 - Fedora or Monken

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#33 2017-12-13 20:02:20 - Fedora or Monken

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#34 2017-12-13 20:06:15 - Fedora or Monken

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#35 2017-12-13 21:43:41 - Fedora or Monken

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#36 2017-12-13 22:09:09 - Fedora or Monken

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#37 2017-12-13 22:22:37 - Fedora or Monken

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#38 2017-12-14 07:24:55 - Fedora or Monken

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#39 2017-12-14 07:26:09 - Fedora or Monken

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#40 2017-12-14 07:43:14 - Fedora or Monken

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